A Commenter’s Rights

When you leave a comment on a comment, how often do you wonder what your rights are? Not too often, I’d guess. Over the years, it has become an accepted fact that content contributed to a website simply belongs to that website. If the website, or blog for today’s web, goes away then all of your contributions disappear along with it.

A real world analogy would be sending in letters or artwork to a magazine. There’s usually that disclaimer which says the publication can do whatever with your submission. And, of course, they can’t return anything to you. It belongs to the magazine now.

A different view

The landscape, however, is somewhat changing. It wasn’t too long ago that big media began to realize that they need to embrace their audiences. One dimensional publication became two dimensional and refocused around users, the people that consume and contribute. Leaving comments has become more than just simple responses. Many are very long and well thought out. They’ve essentially become blog posts left on others’ blogs.

Do comments need to solely belong to the blog on which it sits on? I’m not so sure it does. Comments are, in some way, the currency in which bloggers are paid for their posts. Bloggers want to encourage active discussions on their site. A way to encourage discussion is to give the participants more control of their contributions.

This blog post is largely inspired by Hank Williams’ blog post which asks, Who has comment copyright ownership? Hank makes the point that blog platforms and services such as Disqus should make this clear for both bloggers and the people who comment. I agree.

Rights and Control

So what are a commenter’s rights? I’m going to make an initial attempt to materialize what some rights should be.

a) The ability to edit and remove their comments
b) Access to all of their comments, even if it has been deleted on a blog
c) The right to use their own comments as blog posts. After all, a commenter is just a publisher not writing on his own website.
d) A life for the comment beyond a single blog. I want to take my comments with me, even if the blog shuts down.

This may seem threatening to the publisher, but it really isn’t. A commenter should have rights to what they post, but bloggers should still have control over content that appear on their blogs. Bloggers should still control:

a) Whether or not someone is allowed to comment on his blog
b) The deletion of a comment
c) The modification of a comment, as long as the original copy is still accessible and the edit is transparent

Ownership

All of this may result in some ambiguous notion of shared ownership between commenters and bloggers. This needs to be clarified somehow, preferably with the cooperation of all the companies and services doing things in this area.

Tool and Platform

I don’t want us to be hypocritical. We’ve heard the charges: our platform is proprietary and we store comments on our server. This is true. However, we’ve embraced openness from the start with our API and willingness to open up our platform to anyone to build on. We’ve spent some time thinking about where to go from here and we’ve come up with something that could be great. I won’t talk about it now, but I can say that it involves everyone playing nicely together, including our competitors.

Regarding ownership, I want to make it clear that Disqus does not want to own your comments, whether you are a blogger using Disqus or a reader commenting on this system.

We position ourselves as two things: a tool and a discussion platform. I call it a platform because people are using what we’ve built to create new tools for conversation. This excites us over here.

This platform is moving toward openness. I feel this will help us succeed as a company. Disqus began to solve problems of fragmentation and we don’t want to create further fragmentation by being closed. We will come out on top because our tools and products will be better, not because the platform is locked.

Moving forward

We have learned a lot in the recent months. The next major updates to Disqus will explicitly address a number of these issues right in the service itself, including a clarification of a commenter’s rights in our policy.

This is only a first draft to solicit some thoughts. Fred Wilson recognized it as a straw man proposal. He’s right. We want to generate discussion and ideas. What do you think? Whether you blog, comment, or both: what is important to you?

View Comments

Daniel on May 30th 2008 in disqus


  • That Sounds interesting, I agree with you.Please keep at your good work, I would come back often.
  • That's the great article! I just pass 'n read it, two thumbs up! ;)
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  • wallace530
    great post sir..
    thanks for sharing. really helped a lot here.
    --------------------------------------------------
    Ugg Boots | Uggs
  • Thanks for sharing this commenter's rights, its a good way to express our believe if we comment
  • ryanlow
    I have noticed that Disqus doesn't have the delete function and does this means that Disqus also agree that there is no commenter's rights and that our comments belong to the blogger?
  • Without this post, I always thought that the comments that we said doesn't belong to us. This isn't fair for the commenters. Who will want to comment when it is just there to boost the reputation of the particular blogger and nothing for you. I don't think a commenter is just a back end scene helper right?
  • ryanlow
    I have noticed that Disqus doesn't have the delete function and does this means that Disqus also agree that there is no commenter's rights and that our comments belong to the blogger?
  • Without this post, I always thought that the comments that we said doesn't belong to us. This isn't fair for the commenters. Who will want to comment when it is just there to boost the reputation of the particular blogger and nothing for you. I don't think a commenter is just a back end scene helper right?
  • jonaw
    Yes.This is the post that put all our commenter's thoughts together.It's seemingly unbelievable that nobody has any issue over the rights of our comments. Disqus should address to it appropriately.
  • Ryan Low
    I have noticed that Disqus doesn't have the delete function and does this means that Disqus also agree that there is no commenter's rights and that our comments belong to the blogger?
  • Annie
    Without this post, I always thought that the comments that we said doesn't belong to us. This isn't fair for the commenters. Who will want to comment when it is just there to boost the reputation of the particular blogger and nothing for you. I don't think a commenter is just a back end scene helper right?
  • SEO
    The above content is very true and i guess every site should follow this in order to get as much comments as they want on their blogs..
  • SEO
    The above content is very true and i guess every site should follow this in order to get as much comments as they want on their blogs..
  • SEO
    The above content is very true and i guess every site should follow this in order to get as much comments as they want on their blogs..
  • ezditto
    yes agree!clarifications should be done. Its unfair for commenters.
  • Duple Ang
    Great article!I Commenter's right should be addressed properly.
  • replicaloh
    I agree that we should have the rights to our own comments.After all, we are the commenters. Words are coming from us.
  • Jasmine Lim
    I never know about comment rights.Will definitely take note of it.
  • Angela Bradford
    266228
  • Angela Bradford
    266228
  • Jo R Hamburg
    great article!, grats for u site :)
  • Make sense. Ownership rights have undefined grey areas. Even google , youtube, facbooks and other giants get themselves into uncharted territories sometimes. One must tread carefully and make sure one don't step on the online landmines.
  • Thanks for the info. May God have mercy on us all.
  • Thanks for the info. May God have mercy on us all.
  • the owner is the author,, so he has the right to what he want in his website and what not
  • the owner is the author,, so he has the right to what he want in his website and what not
  • Great point,I like the idea of a blog being common ground between the blogger and the commenter. I agree that commenters should generally have the full capability to edit and delete their comments, but I think it's key that the creator of the blog have final say on how the blog operates. Thanks for highlighting. P
  • Great point,I like the idea of a blog being common ground between the blogger and the commenter. I agree that commenters should generally have the full capability to edit and delete their comments, but I think it's key that the creator of the blog have final say on how the blog operates. Thanks for highlighting. P
  • Usually this is the case, but you should always remember to link back and give credit to the original author.
  • great post. Every blogger should know about these rights
  • John Alex
    great post. Every blogger should know about these rights
  • John Alex
    great post. Every blogger should know about these rights
  • Ownership is kind of subjective with lots of gray areas to address. Mind boggling, huh.
  • Yup indeed. I didn't know i have any rights for the comments i made. That sounds cool ! Now i know them . Thanks for the useful information and link.
  • Yup indeed. I didn't know i have any rights for the comments i made. That sounds cool ! Now i know them . Thanks for the useful information and link.
  • Yup indeed. I didn't know i have any rights for the comments i made. That sounds cool ! Now i know them . Thanks for the useful information and link.
  • For me, as a commenter,I respect that the blog owner has the right to delete the comments for a reason..
    But, the blog owner should also inform the commenter about the comment that he/she posts..
  • For me, as a commenter,I respect that the blog owner has the right to delete the comments for a reason..
    But, the blog owner should also inform the commenter about the comment that he/she posts..
  • all of the commenter will surely read this,
  • thanks for those ideas, i really love the concept
  • Every people will have a different view and opinion. They can comment whatever they want. Just that at the end of the day, only the ownership of the blog, the blogger, will has the right to keep or delete the comment.
  • Every people will have a different view and opinion. They can comment whatever they want. Just that at the end of the day, only the ownership of the blog, the blogger, will has the right to keep or delete the comment.
  • This is new, didn't know commentor have rights. It's so nice to be in the free world.
  • This is new, didn't know commentor have rights. It's so nice to be in the free world.
  • This is new, didn't know commentor have rights. It's so nice to be in the free world.
  • I think any article on the internet should be able to be used by anyone.
  • I think any article on the internet should be able to be used by anyone.
  • LN
    Indeed, Disqus is a great commenting tool. It is much different than what I saw so far
  • LN
    Indeed, Disqus is a great commenting tool. It is much different than what I saw so far
  • nulls102
    Thanks for sharing this news .

    Best regards
    Nulos

    http://thenewsempire.com/Gaming/
  • victoria
    i dont think that you should make up your own bill of rights. unless you have fought and know what it is like to get your own freedom. as a doctor in the war i believe that you should keep the freedom that your country has given you. most countries do not even get these they can only dream of these.
  • victoria
    i dont think that you should make up your own bill of rights. unless you have fought and know what it is like to get your own freedom. as a doctor in the war i believe that you should keep the freedom that your country has given you. most countries do not even get these they can only dream of these.
  • This post has really got me thinking. I'm not sure how to feel yet because it's a tough issue.
  • Very good thoughts.
    Your "Rights and Control" fit perfectly with what I wanted to convey on my site www.restaurantsinpr.com .

    Thanks!
  • Very good thoughts.
    Your "Rights and Control" fit perfectly with what I wanted to convey on my site www.restaurantsinpr.com .

    Thanks!
  • Very good thoughts.
    Your "Rights and Control" fit perfectly with what I wanted to convey on my site www.restaurantsinpr.com .

    Thanks!
  • agreed!
  • Pete
    In lieu of a contract where consideration is exchanged, the commenter owns his comments, without license, and can do anything he wants with them, including sending a DMCA notification to the blog or service that they're hosted on to have them removed.
  • Once posted the content is under control of bog owners ! To many restrictions slow down the process
  • Once posted the content is under control of bog owners ! To many restrictions slow down the process
  • I am a pedant and occasionally used to edit conventional Web 1.0 comments left on my WP blog to fix obvious typos, capitalisation and add asterisks to mask profanity.

    It just struck me that even as a Disqus Administrator, I can no longer edit any comments (apart from my own) although I can remove comments.

    So, let's forget this earnest discussion of 'commenter's rights', what about the rights of Administrator/SuperUser/Root/God and other deities ?

    Shouldn't I be omnipotent and all-powerful in my one man crusade, striving, against all odds, for correct grammar and punctuation as I continue to fight the good fight (unpaid too) against dumbing down and so called 'text speak' ?
  • I agree with the notion that publishers should not lose functionality
    they were once familiar with, as long as a commenter still retains
    their original content.
  • I agree with the notion that publishers should not lose functionality
    they were once familiar with, as long as a commenter still retains
    their original content.
  • I agree with the notion that publishers should not lose functionality
    they were once familiar with, as long as a commenter still retains
    their original content.
  • I agree with the notion that publishers should not lose functionality
    they were once familiar with, as long as a commenter still retains
    their original content.
  • "blog this comment" has been on my mind lately.
    i do this from time to time. not to fragment a discussion but to log my output (if i think its worth logging).
    this is mainly for my own benefit but also is good for those who may find their way to my site.
    i link back to the original post and to my comment url when doing this.

    i would like to see disqus add integration to cross-post my comments on disqus powered sites to my own site (ie. tumblr). it's easy to do. i prefer NOT to add another widget or suck in a comment feed into my site because i dont want every comment i make added to my site.

    one problem with comment services such as disqus is the fact that for it to be 100% effective, everyone should be using the same comment service. this isn't the fault of disqus or any other service of course. but it's the reality of the situation.

    i don't know if it can be truly solved unless the "service" is not a single private company... like say if the Mozilla Foundation setup a solution for commenting... maybe even built into the Firefox browser.... that could be more adoptable and universal. Or I could see a Google or Yahoo or Amazon even.... or a federation of all of these types of entities.... agreeing on standards and semantics.... providing something that makes adding a comment and allowing that data to be movable and portable as desired.... as an automated platform that can be initiated on any web page. In other words, a Non-Profit effort. Because at some point, Disqus and other start-up companies need to make money and that only introduces potential annoyances into the commentsphere... a space currently untouched by monetization engines for the most part. The question of "How do you make money from the millions of comments on the open web" is interesting. If at some point ads are injected into comment threads in order to sustain the companies that have decided to provide comment services... it wouldn't necessarily be terrible, especially if revenue is properly shared with all people involved in th thread (yes i said ALL ;) and the "sponsor" posts are clearly marked as such... well... that's the business of it really. I'd prefer it not get inundated with advertisements but am aware that it can be done in an elegant manner.

    So comment services like disqus here are approaching this very large frontier. I'd be willing to bet that Google (or other BIGGIES) are developing similar service and am actually surprised that they have not already released something a year or 2 ago. They have left this space open to tech entrepreneurs. Well let's not forget that they can and will buy the best of breed (you are working for google before you work for google).

    Oh and I do agree that I dont like the idea of my comments being edited by others.
    If so, my original post needs to be accessible. If that original post contains content that is not suitable for public consumption or simply offensive etc... then the comment should be rejected with an easy way for me to edit it and resubmit so it can be reconsidered and published.

    Apologies for the ranty comment.... not sure if this one is blog worthy :)
  • To clarify --

    Self-hosted platforms already give publishers the ability to edit
    comments. Since your comment is on someone else's blog, they are free
    to make whatever changes they see fit.

    What I was personally proposing is an amendment to that ability. If
    publishers *do* edit comments, the original content should always be
    accessible and presentable.
  • i agree with that. version control for comments.
  • i agree with that. version control for comments.
  • Good stuff :)
  • Sorry to be pedantic but if and when you do produce a policy on this, I think it would sound a lot better if you replaced all the 'he' and 'his' references with 'he/she' and 'his/her', or even 'they' and 'theirs'- it just struck me while reading this post that implying that all writers and commenters are male seems a bit dated.
  • It is probably dated. Using "he" for ambiguous pronouns was the
    grammar I was taught in school. Just sayin'. :)

    More formal writing is used in the actual policies.
  • Good stuff :)
  • Angyl
    I think it's worth considering if there is a difference between a "comment" as a standalone entity and a "conversation". Perhaps it might make sense to allow a commenter to edit their comment only so long as it has not been replied to. Once it has been replied to, it's a conversation and "rewriting history" is a more relevant concern. Also if the comment is being republished or syndicated elsewhere, that might be grounds for locking down editing. An editing window seems practical for typos, bad HTML, etc, but locking down editing abilities once a conversation is underway seems intuitive. Blog owners editing the comments of others has a sketchy blink, though, no matter how well-documented. There might be some other method to capture the goals of this idea that's less sketchy, like perhaps allowing the blog owner to screen the comment and suggest a change to the original commenter, who can then edit on their own and be unscreened if they choose?
  • elpollo
    There has been a lot of discussion regarding who owns what, Stating with Scobble's post a few days ago, where he got upset that his post was removed.
    My belief is , the blog owner can do what he feels best, if it is deleting the so be it, it is his blog, if you don't like it then do post there, However that will eventually back fire for him, since we all know that the true conversations come from not censoring, so it is his lost.
    The alternative is to use services that track comments and make a copy of them, so even if they are deleted they will still be able to be read somewhere else, such as in cocomment, not sure if disqus does the same.
    Those are my thoughts.
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